| Griffyn Heels | Whats PMNMI? |
| quietone | Postponed Maintainer Needs More Information |
| quietone | Many months ago, I triaged and added a 3 month notice to PMNMI issues in migrate. Then, after the three months another migrate maintainer reviewed those issues. The result was that all but one was closed.That worked well and I suggest we do the same. |
| larowlan | Sounds great, can we crowd source this at the sprint on Friday |
| quietone | As a start date I use 2020-04-21 which is from the initial stats, https://www.drupal.org/community-initiatives/bug-smash-initiative/goals |
| lendude | Do we have an ok for using the 3 month period? Think @xjm had some insights into a good period to use last time we talked about this? |
| lendude | Can’t remember what came out of that discussion |
| quietone | Links to two meetings where I found discussion. [#3195107]The second issue has input from xjm, suggesting the three months. The last comment in the thread was a self reminder for xjm to look at the templates. I don't think that has happened. |
| Kristen Pol (she/her) | Excellent suggestion @quietone. Thanks for the reminder |
| quietone | This is likely a small group of issue but a group where we have found that closing the old one and opening a new one is the way to move it forward.Maybe we could find them all and work through them. |
| larowlan | We'd need to ask drumm I think |
| quietone | @drumm, is it easy to get a list of these issues? |
| tim | I posted in the wrong thread....https://drupal.slack.com/archives/C014QES6HSQ/p1629175932123600?thread_t... |
| quietone | thanks for the nudge. I had a csv of open issues from working on the stats. I wrote a batch script to get the issue number and then to find those that are in the git log. I get 55 results. |
| drumm | I think we have all that data in the DB. Not exactly easy, but doable. Is this still needed, looks like you might have found a way already? |
| Matroskeen | @quietone, that's nice! We can close at lease one of them :smiley:#3192059 was supposed to be backported to 8.9, but it's not gonna happen.Quick instructions how to deal with such issues are available in one of the previous meetings: https://drupal.slack.com/archives/C014QES6HSQ/p1623125376125100p.s. I went ahead and closed it. (edited) |
| catch | @nod_ was working on some issue queue mining and might be able to pull this. |
| nod_ | do you need issues for D7 as well? or 8+? |
| nod_ | got 371 issues |
| nod_ | [ CSV file, see link below ] |
| nod_ | kinda uses commit data from a couple of weeks ago but it's a start. takes commits from about 2012, if an issue was committed earlier and is still open it won't be in this list |
| nod_ | added the human readable status |
| catch | @nod_ I'm pretty sure only 8.x issues for this channel - thanks for digging those out! |
| larowlan | thanks, this will be a good triage target for today @pameeela @Griffyn Heels |
| larowlan | put into a sheet https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/16P7m6IlLWgez0Q79UDT14MC-hJYlssQj... and filtered out patch to be ported and d7 |
| quietone | A list of thoughts I had.Run like a regular meeting with issues in threadsAnnounce a set of issues or component to be triagedAnnounce in other relevant channels that the triage is happeningInvite the relevant maintainer or other know keen person to joinKeep open for 24 hours |
| mohit_aghera | +1 to Run like a regular meeting with issues in threads andAnnounce a set of issues or component to be triaged |
| larowlan | That sounds great |
| larowlan | I think we'd need a champion to take on the job of organising them |
| larowlan | I wonder if @kattekrab has any ideas on if this |
| larowlan | do you think we could spend some time at the sprint fleshing this out some more ? |
| lendude | My only worry is that it could fill up the channel fairly quickly, and it might be hard to find the issue that actually needs discussing, ie. we do 10 issues, 9 are easy, 1 is hard, but its the third issue on the list so nobody sees that this still needs discussion cause it too far back in the slack history. I don’t know, maybe I’m going for premature optimisation here and we should try it and see |
| larowlan | we could spin up a triage channel if that became an issue |
| lendude | Yeah, we should try it and see and tweak from there |
| kattekrab | Interesting! Thanks @larowlan - I might have some ideas if I wasn't sleep deprived. Very much agree with you @lendude "Just try, then tweak" Good suggestion @quietone |
| kattekrab | Triage is well focussed - timeboxing, and trying to filter for complexity might be useful frames |
| kattekrab | Is everyone familiar with the cynefin model? Clear - Complicated - Complex - Chaotic? |
| kattekrab | image.png |
| dww | Yes, an async triage meeting sounds great. Definitely worth trying & tweaking. |
| dww | Also from the Premature Optimization Department (where I spend way too much time): I wonder if the nature of these async slack meetings will add any friction to actually taking the actions in the issues themselves. Eg, a couple people respond to a question in a thread, and it seems like agreement. Some possible risks to progress:Everyone thinks someone else will update the issue.Some temptation for “seems like agreement, but maybe we should wait for New York to wake up before we close that one...” No later responses come : when / how to circle back and go with whatever plan we’ve got so far... |
| dww | Proposed mitigations:A) it’s only an issue. Folks can post new comments, undo metadata changes, etc. Just post something and if we change minds later, change the issue accordingly |
| dww | B) make good use of thread icons, be sure to update, so we can more easily circle back later to anything not :checkbox: |
| dww | :point_up: would also help with Len’s concern |
| lendude | Yeah B) sounds really good, maybe also removing the preview when it has been resolved so resolved stuff takes up less space? |
| dww | @kattekrab hadn’t heard of that, but looks interesting. I started at https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cynefin_frameworkSeems like a good, clear summary. Any better places to learn more? |
| dww | This caught my eye:"best practice is, by definition, past practice"sounds like something to also keep in mind. I should post that to the #gitlab meeting. ;) maybe if I share it widely enough, I’ll take it to heart, and be less complacent in the technical aspects of my life. |
| Kristen Pol (she/her) | Excellent idea @quietone and I agree with keeping it simple and the UX improvements above to keep the channel tidy and helpful |
| quietone | Some of @dww concerns can also be handled with by someone checking the threads for decisions or followups. This stuff often falls to the facilitator but I am cautious about overloading the expectations of a facilitator. |
| larowlan | Any thing you want us to focus on |
| larowlan | First time contribution tasks would be great |
| quietone | Helping people to (learn how to) review issues |
| larowlan | Yes, @jibran did that in Melbourne a few years back +1 |
| quietone | @jibran, what did you do? |
| larowlan | he got up on stage and talked through a review |
| larowlan | like the live commit, but a live review |
| jibran | Dude! that's 6.5 years ago. :smile: |
| jibran | You pretty much have to present whatever you want sprinters to do. |
| larowlan | 6.5 years really? |
| larowlan | wow, that went so fast |
| jibran | DrupalSouth Melbourne was held in March 2015. |
| larowlan | :exploding_head: |
| larowlan | the sprint is free for anyone to attend - no need to have a ticket |
| larowlan | i'll post in this channel the details on Friday |
| Kristen Pol (she/her) | I'll try to attend, thanks for organizing |
| ambermatz | I’ll do a social post from the Drupalize.Me account promoting the sprint and encouraging folks to check out bugsmash issues. |
| jibran | Maybe @Gábor Hojtsy (he/him) can use his social media influence as well. :smile: |
| ambermatz | Here’s a link to the tweet just posted: https://twitter.com/drupalizeme/status/1428137177855184900 |
| Gábor Hojtsy (he/him) | RTed :) |
